ios 7

June 19, 2013 1:17 PM

Would it be permissible for mefi to facilitate users getting ios 7 udid registration ?

Mefites are a talented lot - Some of us are ios developers, some of us will literally perish without the ios 7 update ahead of time, surely this is a no brainer in the vein of when gmail accounts were being given out.

I think this is a great opportunity for caring sharing mefites to virtually hug each other.

If not, all those apple advocates on mefi who have pushed the rest of us into apple fandom should be taking a good look at themselves in the imirror.

I would type more, but the shakes are kicking in.

posted by sgt.serenity to Etiquette/Policy at 1:17 PM (40 comments total)

I am not at all familiar with the iOS 7 scheme, could someone who knows what the deal is maybe clarify whether this is actually a practical and practicable thing for mefite Apple dev folks?
posted by cortex (staff) at 1:30 PM on June 19, 2013

Here lies
-SGT. SERENITY-

He Had to Wait Several Months to Download a Phone Thing

✿ R.I.P. ✿
posted by theodolite at 1:32 PM on June 19, 2013 [45 favorites]

Apparently a dev udid isn't required?a IDK, sir. It's hell out there.
posted by boo_radley at 1:45 PM on June 19, 2013 [2 favorites]

I believe this sort of thing is generally frowned-up by Apple and could end up with developers getting into trouble. In any case, as boo_radley points out, a quick Google suggests that it's possible to install the dev beta independently.

I'd also advise anyone thinking of this to read TUAW's article, PSA: If you're not a developer, don't install developer betas on your iPhone. As they say,

"What Apple calls "beta" is what most other developers would call "alpha" -- software never intended for use by the general public, released only to small numbers of (hopefully) knowledgable people for testing purposes."

FWIW, a couple of developers at our company installed iOS 7 and quickly uninstalled it after encountering several issues; it's not a good idea to run it on your personal phone.

Also, if you do install it, please do not be that guy who emails us saying "Your app doesn't do X in iOS 7." For god's sake, the beta has only been out for a week! Normal people aren't even supposed to be using it! Even if we somehow had been able to update the app in that time for iOS 7, it wouldn't have been approved by Apple yet. Grr...
posted by adrianhon at 2:15 PM on June 19, 2013 [1 favorite]

some of us will literally perish without the ios 7 update ahead of time

You will probably want to wait before installing iOS 7 on a primary-use device. If anything, you can't decide to go back to a stable 6 install, if you don't like how the beta works.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 2:28 PM on June 19, 2013

If you're actually an iOS developer, as in registered in Apple's Developer Program, you already have access to iOS and OS X betas.

Otherwise, you are probably not really an iOS developer and you don't need it. You will probably not know what you are doing, and you will break things and be dependent on others to unbreak those things.
posted by ardgedee at 2:32 PM on June 19, 2013 [2 favorites]

Here lies
-SGT. SERENITY-

He Had to Wait Several Months to Download a Phone Thing

✿ R.I.P. ✿


Along with "back in 5 mins", that is a serious headstone contender.

I'm thinking the iphone5 battery life is so abysmal ios7 wont break much anyway....i'm kind of envisioning a sort of we are the world moment here occuring on mefi, please think of those poor people who cannot remove newstand.
posted by sgt.serenity at 2:42 PM on June 19, 2013 [2 favorites]

I installed IOS 7 a few days ago through easily obtained (ahoy!) means. Don't do it.
It was neat to play around with but a third of my applications would not work with it - of course those were my favorite apps and Murphy says they will be yours as well. Additionally the phone had power issues etc ... all par for the course for a Beta so I downgraded back to ios 6 - again easily done if you know how - if you don't you'll probably brick your phone and be too embarrassed to take it to the Apple store.


Regarding Mefi getting involved to obtain UDIDs - I am SURE that this breaks Apples developer agreement and MeFi will get in trouble with Big Fruit if it attempts to do this.

tldr: Mefi - don't do this. and you don't need a udid to install ios7
posted by Podkayne of Pasadena at 2:43 PM on June 19, 2013 [4 favorites]

The iOS 7 beta is only for developers. Apple will cancel the developer account of any developer who gives iOS 7 to anyone who isn't a developer. If they have apps in the store, all the apps will be removed. I'm afraid this suggestion is a non-starter.

I suggest closing this thread. There's really nothing to discuss here.
posted by alms at 2:57 PM on June 19, 2013 [5 favorites]

a couple of developers at our company installed iOS 7 and quickly uninstalled it after encountering several issues

Wait, i was under the impression that they weren't signing/allowing downgrades from 7 to 6? I remember that coming up several times during coverage of WWDC.
posted by emptythought at 3:04 PM on June 19, 2013 [1 favorite]

I am not a developer but installed the ios7 beta for kicks anyway - as others have noted , absolutely no UDID required.

It's usable, but buggy in a lot of places and certain apps no longer work (incl Apple's own podcasts app)... if you must try it (and I obviously understand the motivation - it's fun to kick the tires on something new) I'd recommend at least trying to hold off until beta 2 unless you have a high tolerance for random phone crashes, piss poor battery life, and a lot of apps not working.
posted by modernnomad at 3:04 PM on June 19, 2013

Wait, i was under the impression that they weren't signing/allowing downgrades from 7 to 6?

Restore from backup. It's pretty common.

I think sharing codes for things people can't get is fine. Bypassing easily obtainable dev credentials is unethical in my mind.

Guess it's time to die.
posted by cjorgensen at 3:59 PM on June 19, 2013

Restore from backup. It's pretty common.

No. You can't revert iOS devices to previous os versions. It's a long-standing pain in the arse.
posted by alms at 4:21 PM on June 19, 2013

The weird thing too, is that i remember when the iOS 6 beta came out(and 5 before it) they were still signing installs of the current, non beta version until the new one made it all the way through beta and hit GM/gold.

I don't really get why they'd stop doing that. Maybe they changed os 7 so much that it would require DFU to downgrade or something, and they didn't want to foist that on people? Because as it stands, basically everyone went out and bought an ipod touch 5 just to run this stuff on even if they already had testing systems.

It makes it kinda seem like a tiresome cash grab on apples part that they're not only saying "we're making this non-removable so you really have to dedicate a system to running only this" but also that this is more than likely going to be the status quo moving forward, which is properly shit IMO. Everyone is going to need not only a couple systems to test their software against for the current OS version, but also dedicated ones for the betas.
posted by emptythought at 4:29 PM on June 19, 2013

You can't revert iOS devices to previous os versions.

I've reverted phone OS before, but guess not from betas.
posted by cjorgensen at 4:48 PM on June 19, 2013

You can't revert iOS devices to previous os versions.

You can. I personally reverted from iOS 7 beta 1 back to the latest and greatest iOS 6.1.4 without any issues after I realized that iOS 7 in its current halfway-completed state made me want to shoot myself.

For what it's worth, there are a zillion sites where you can buy a developer activation for iOS 7 for 5 bucks. Took me about half an hour on iOS 7 beta launch night.
posted by killdevil at 6:47 PM on June 19, 2013 [2 favorites]

You can. I personally reverted from iOS 7 beta 1 back to the latest and greatest iOS 6.1.4 without any issues...

Wow, I stand corrected. This didn't used to be possible, and Apple still states that it's not possible in the developer portal. Good to know.
posted by alms at 8:40 PM on June 19, 2013

I've had only minimal problems with iOS7 on a recent iPhone 5. If you are trying to make a living as an IOS developer you should will find your business prospects improve substantially when you join the IOS developer program.
posted by humanfont at 9:50 PM on June 19, 2013 [1 favorite]

This is a terrible idea, if you are suggesting what I think you're suggesting. Apple's beta's are generally pretty damn bad. I'm a developer and, having seen the new OS in action, won't be touching it for at least a week or two after it's released.

This release is a big change. Stuff is going to break, in particular UI layout. You don't want to be on the cutting edge here unless you're the surgeon trying to sew that cut & bleeding edge closed.

And frankly, it's not that exciting. It's a nice update but a lot of it is cosmetic.
posted by chairface at 11:24 PM on June 19, 2013

I disagree with most other people here, because I think iOS 7 is super exciting, totally worth upgrading to, and you should totally try it even if you're not a developer. Broken apps are for ADVENTURERS. And adventurers are kind of like Sergeants I guess so are YOU ready to take the something something challenge? Yeah. I bet you are.

You don't need a UDID for iOS 7, though. Figure out your device's serial number, find a torrent of iOS 7 that matches it. While the torrent downloads, make a physical backup of your phone's data just in case. iTunes lets you save a copy to a specific location—do that just so you can be certain you know exactly what to do if things fuck up. Once the torrent is downloaded, hold the Alt key and click "search for upgrades" or whatever on iTunes. The button that's not "restore from backup". Holding Alt will allow you to select a file to upgrade from, so pick your torrented file and you're all set!

No need to do this through MetaFilter, unless the upgrade method I just described breaks for you. Which it might. And if there are enough MeFi devs, then a thread where people upgrade their phones the "right" way with their help would be doable. Basically a developer can add UDIDs to their account, so we could have a thread of people listing their UDIDs and developers go down the list and add whichever devices aren't already on the Approved list. I did that with Reddit for iOS 6, only they were buying NEW developer accounts and asking users to cough up $3 to pay for their share.
posted by Rory Marinich at 4:53 AM on June 20, 2013

So we're past "How to I bypass the requirements to legitimately put a beta on my phone?" and are into "Here's how to do it illegally."?

It makes it kinda seem like a tiresome cash grab on apples part that they're not only saying "we're making this non-removable so you really have to dedicate a system to running only this" but also that this is more than likely going to be the status quo moving forward, which is properly shit IMO. Everyone is going to need not only a couple systems to test their software against for the current OS version, but also dedicated ones for the betas.

Do you think the extra devices, even if your scenario were true, would have any significant impact on Apple's bottom line? Next, do you think developers don't already do this? They have to have every version of the phone they intend to target running each of the OSes they plan to target. You can only go so far with simulators.
posted by cjorgensen at 6:33 AM on June 20, 2013

Illegal? It's not illegal to violate a TOS. Let's not throw that word around.
posted by inturnaround at 6:42 AM on June 20, 2013 [2 favorites]

They have to have every version of the phone they intend to target running each of the OSes they plan to target.
In my experience that may be true for big development companies, but no indie developer actually has that. They usually have a sort-of common new iPhone and iPad running the latest iOS and rely on beta testers (if you're lucky) or customer reports (surprisingly common) for the rest.
posted by blub at 6:47 AM on June 20, 2013

Illegal? It's not illegal to violate a TOS. Let's not throw that word around.

It's illegal to download a torrent of copyrighted software. So wasn't throwing it around. So either you missed that one, or we have a difference of opinion on the definition of illegal.
posted by cjorgensen at 6:53 AM on June 20, 2013

It's illegal to download a torrent of copyrighted software.

A lot of things are illegal that shouldn't be. I fail to see how enthusiasts running an early version of software that Apple will ultimately distribute to their devices for free does any harm at all to Apple. If anything, more devices running the beta means more usage and crash log telemetry making its way back to Cupertino, leading to a higher-quality final release.
posted by killdevil at 7:49 AM on June 20, 2013

My argument isn't that it harms Apple. My argument is that abetting illegal behavior is not what metafilter is for. (I'm not even going to address the argument of what is but shouldn't be illegal. That's a straw man.)

> I am not at all familiar with the iOS 7 scheme, could someone who knows what the deal is maybe clarify whether this is actually a practical and practicable thing for mefite Apple dev folks?

I say asked and answered. At this point I don't see how further discussion is at all anything related to metafilter.

If you want access to prerelease software there are existing channels for this. Nothing anyone has put forth as a suggestion has anything to do with metafilter.
posted by cjorgensen at 7:56 AM on June 20, 2013 [1 favorite]

What rules does Apple have in place with their dev program to keep people from adding their friends as fellow developers? I imagine they discourage pay for access, but beyond that, I don't know what else.

So fine, we don't talk about torrenting iOS 7. Talking about adding friends to your dev account in exchange for no quid pro quo seems perfectly fine and not illegal.
posted by inturnaround at 12:42 PM on June 20, 2013

Already addressed upthread, but my take is this would be a TOS violation. Even if not, my take is metafilter shouldn't be facilitating such exchanges. You can disagree.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:52 PM on June 20, 2013

Word of warning a coworker nearly bricked her iPhone installing the wrong update by mistake. I'm not sure exactly how we managed to get it to come back to us, unless Siri understands the rosary.
posted by humanfont at 3:13 PM on June 20, 2013

Do you think the extra devices, even if your scenario were true, would have any significant impact on Apple's bottom line?

Drop in the bucket, but that wasn't my point. It's still a tiresome shakedown that effects their developers, while also not making them much money. This is why i called it a cash grab. They're basically raising the costs of being a dev again.

Next, do you think developers don't already do this? They have to have every version of the phone they intend to target running each of the OSes they plan to target. You can only go so far with simulators.

The people with millions of downloads do. The guy in his dorm, parents basement, or tiny apartment doing it when he gets home from his day job likely doesn't. The barrier to entry before this was pretty much "Own an iphone and an ipad. There were people who wrote iphone specific apps who just had one iphone.

This may all be moot as they seem to have lifted the restriction on stepping back to OS6. But it would be a shitty precedent to set if this is how it's going to be in the future.

Anything that raises the bar for how much hardware, and therefor $$$ out the gate to develop for their platform is a negative thing IMO.
posted by emptythought at 3:16 PM on June 20, 2013

I don't think expecting someone to possess the hardware they intend to target is that onerous, but that's just me. I barrier to entry has never been lower.
posted by cjorgensen at 4:15 PM on June 20, 2013

This iOS7, it allows you to delete Newstand?
posted by maryr at 6:43 PM on June 20, 2013

...does it vibrate too?
posted by maryr at 6:43 PM on June 20, 2013

You can't actually delete Newsstand, no, but you can at least hide it in a folder now. And there's no limit to how much you can put in folders, so you can create a "Junk Drawer" and throw all the junk you don't really want into it.
posted by duien at 7:10 PM on June 20, 2013

Can you do that to Newsstand though? You couldn't put it in a folder in 6.
posted by cjorgensen at 7:16 PM on June 20, 2013

In iOS 7 Newstand is an app. You can put it inside a folder, it takes over the whole screen when you run, and you still can't move anything out of it (e.g. if you want to put a magazine at the top level of your desktop you're still SOL).
posted by alms at 6:34 AM on June 21, 2013

I just upgraded my wife's iPad to iOS 6. Like Treebeard said, there's no need to be hasty.

Don't you have to pay to develop iOS apps? I'm not a mobile app developer but I downloaded the android sdk legally for free to create a toy app for my android. I don't know if you have to pay to publish to the google play store. I never looked into it because I'm not a mobile dev and nobody wants an app that bounces a ball back and forth across the screen :)
posted by double block and bleed at 5:18 AM on June 22, 2013

Thanks, guys it looks great and runs well - slight niggles but no more so than an android final release.
posted by sgt.serenity at 10:51 AM on June 23, 2013

I fail to see how enthusiasts running an early version of software that Apple will ultimately distribute to their devices for free does any harm at all to Apple.

Apart from the considerable lackwits who get developer betas and then are all UR APP DONE BROKED ONE STAR about it, when the actual devs are working their arses off to report bugs and make their apps iOS 7 compatible in time for its release.

MeFi needs not to be in the 'this is why we can't have nice things' business.
posted by holgate at 5:25 PM on June 23, 2013 [1 favorite]

I don't know if you have to pay to publish to the google play store.

You do, but this is Metafilter and we don't talk about such things here.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 8:04 PM on June 24, 2013