Why was this AskMe deleted?

November 4, 2005 2:36 PM

Just wondering why askmefi thread 26643 was deleted. (As you've grown older what sort of changes have you seen in your face?)

I bookmarked the question and never got round to reading it, and now it's gone.

I can normally understand why a question doesn't fit askmefi, but this one I don't get. So please satisfy my curiosity - why was it deleted?
posted by suleikacasilda to Etiquette/Policy at 2:36 PM (36 comments total)

It's chatty and without purpose. There is no problem to be solved, no utility in the question. That kind of question tends to get deleted.
posted by cortex at 2:49 PM on November 4, 2005

Oh yes, I can see that now. The words "I'm wondering" is a clue.

I suppose I thought the last section (asking for experiences of cosmetic surgery) might have saved it.

The question got me thinking, and I would have replied, so I rather liked it.
posted by suleikacasilda at 2:56 PM on November 4, 2005

Y'know, I can't tell if you're snarking at a perceived (but not intended) snarkiness in my tone or if I'm just misperceiving snarkiness that isn't even there. The web is hard. But if you thought I was being snarky, be assured I wasn't. I was just providing the clearest short statement of the situation I could think of.

Some interesting questions get deleted, because AskMe is still explicitly geared toward personal and community utility and not just generalized discussion.
posted by cortex at 3:00 PM on November 4, 2005

If it had been "what changes to human facial structure and appearance generally happen with advancing age? How do our faces change?" it wouldn't have been deleted.
posted by sfenders at 3:10 PM on November 4, 2005

I wasn't snarking at all. I appreciated your reply. Thank you.
posted by suleikacasilda at 3:16 PM on November 4, 2005

I removed it. I wrote to the person who wrote it and let him know why it was removed and suggested ways he could repost a modified version of the same question. It's pretty clear on the AskMe posting page that questions without a problem to be solved, especially ones that tend towards open-ended chattiness, are better for other sites that are more open to this sort of question, most notably MetaChat.

This is the question, if anyone is curious. It's an interesting question, it's just not right for Ask Metafilter.

"As you've grown older what sort of changes have you seen in your face?

I'm just about to turn 31 and I'm delighted to see some character starting to appear: laugh lines, a few furrows, etc. Other things are surprising, like the beginning of baggy skin under my eyes, and the actual shape of my cheeks getting thicker, etc - even a small bump like cyst that I actually like; along with a larger nose, redder ears, and a mole that was once very prominant is now much smaller and fading. I'm not at the wart with a grey hair in it yet but I'm sure I'll welcome that when and if it happens. I personally really love all of it. A life lived is shown in the face, and all that. I'm wondering what you've seen in your self as you've changed over time. Also, for those of you who have had cosmetic surgery - what did you do, how has -it- aged, and why did you do it?"
posted by jessamyn at 3:23 PM on November 4, 2005

It's pretty clear on the AskMe posting page that questions without a problem to be solved, especially ones that tend towards open-ended chattiness, are better for other sites that are more open to this sort of question, most notably MetaChat.

I don't understand that at all. Why can't Askme be used to research things, regardless of their esotericness? I mean, I understand deleting a question like "what was your worst breakup." That's just chat, but a question that asks a specific thing like "bush voters: why did you vote for bush" (one actual example, paraphrased) ask a specific thing. Or something like "what programming language do you like to use for web page design".

The question earlier about why holding an antenna increases reception didn't solve a problem either.

The 'problem' that is being 'solved' the author would like to know something, and doesn't.

I see chatfilter as questions that ask people only for their opinions, rather then asking them for fact.
posted by delmoi at 3:53 PM on November 4, 2005

It was my question - while I'm okay with it getting deleted, I think it proves AskMefi is losing something. It wasn't chatfilter so much as a genuine question that I was pretty invested in an answer from a variety of others oh. Not one about weight, or other body image - but one about our faces and how they change, etc. I wanted to ask Metafilter, specifically.

While I'm currently not looking for a good alternative to my bank mortgage, interested in what bottle of wine to bring to a party where some evasive hot chick might be, or (fill in the blank with a needs list) I am at a point in my life where signs of age are showing up and it's fun to consider. It was a legitimate question, not asking for opinions but for answers. I loved the first and only answer (from five fresh fish I think) before it got chopped off the page.

I find it pretty funny that if my question was "I'm in the market for a new face, what cosmetic surgery should I get" would have stayed on the page with all the others.
posted by Peter H at 4:38 PM on November 4, 2005

Wow, PH, I think I agree with you and I loved you question. It made me think.
posted by snsranch at 4:43 PM on November 4, 2005

Not to be a jerk, because I do love this place (group *hug*), but when AskMefi started up it was questions like this ("when can I fart in front of my girlfriend" being a classic) that made it feel like a pretty unique place; The candor felt exciting. It really reflected how interesting people are here - both in the phrasing of the questions, and the answers. Regulating it to specific Q+A about what to buy and advice makes it feel less like a unique area for what is a pretty smart highly clever-witted community, and more like a Dear Abby counter at the local mall. You're not planning on selling the answers as a CD-Rom of Better Homes & Gardens set of books, so why scrutinize so explicitly? I really think it would have been an interesting thread without snark but actual thoughts, I guess. So excuse any complaining on my part.

on preview - THANKS snsranch - anyway ... (not angry or anything, just responding the meta thread)
posted by Peter H at 4:46 PM on November 4, 2005

My answer was akin to this: my face has filled out, so I'm not so gaunt. I think I finally look solidly healthy. My facial hair has become thicker and grows in faster; where I could once go for a couple days without a shave, now I cast a shadow at the end of the day. My eyebrows shoot out the occasional hentai tentacle hair, forecasting great bushy wildman eyebrows when I'm a senior. Alas, I'm also showing signs that my nosehair may do the same. I have a few persistant wrinkles now, but I've yet to develop my family's good-looking "crinkly eyes." It's all good.
posted by five fresh fish at 4:54 PM on November 4, 2005

I think AskMe threads that don't ask a question should be nuked unless the discussion within is turning out to be enlightening, revealing, insightful, or otherwise high-quality.
posted by five fresh fish at 4:55 PM on November 4, 2005

Peter H, I liked your question too and was interested in the answers. You could always try again. Perhaps if you made it less Mefi-oriented/poll'ish/chatty it would stick. Instead of specifically asking Mefi users, you might ask, in general, how faces change over time to look more "adult." Then people might pipe with stories about their own face and those of loved ones.
posted by nixerman at 5:00 PM on November 4, 2005

...er, which is to say that if my post was the only one within the thread, good call.

If we want to entertain these sort of casual topic-specific, pulled-from-our-ass questions, quandaries, and yakkityyak, we should make a concerted effort to invade Uncensored BBS. In terms of familiarity, the conversations will feel like the ones we have in MeFi but with the topics of AskMe. We could have a lot of fun over there.
posted by five fresh fish at 5:02 PM on November 4, 2005

I too was interested in this question and bookmarked it, planning on coming back to answer. Bummer.
posted by puke & cry at 6:20 PM on November 4, 2005

Thank God that thread was stopped before it took the site down. What would the neighbors have said? God save us from interesting discussions of what it means to be human.
posted by yerfatma at 6:41 PM on November 4, 2005

I sure am glad that question was deleted, and the INSANE SCREED ABOUT JEW ASSASSINS is still up on the blue.
posted by selfnoise at 7:12 PM on November 4, 2005

Oh, wanted to say thank you to suleikacasilda for posting.

Also, please excuse my "not to be a jerk" comment, as it was completely bitchy and without purpose.
posted by Peter H at 7:50 PM on November 4, 2005

It's chatty and without purpose. There is no problem to be solved, no utility in the question.

It's a question asking people to relay their observations about changes in their face. That's pretty darn concrete. This is at least as legitimate as any "what is your experience with ____" question, as any relationship related question (because 95% of that is going to be anecdotal observation), and probably twice as legitimate as any of the music recommendation and discussion threads that tend to proliferate here

I can see the chatty followup and "how do you feel about it" seems to dilute it, though.

suggested ways he could repost a modified version of the same question

That's good. At least as long questions requiring personal observations or reasoning aren't banned categorically.
posted by weston at 8:39 PM on November 4, 2005

A question for people to talk about themselves... what could be more suited to Metafilter?
posted by smackfu at 9:31 PM on November 4, 2005

Forgot to add that OTOH, I think the question about overrated movies is much worse than this one.
posted by smackfu at 9:33 PM on November 4, 2005

I remember when deletion was used as an absolute last resort.

Sadly we seem to be on the path to the one, perfect Metafilter, and thus it had to go.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 10:34 PM on November 4, 2005

jessamyn: suggested ways he could repost a modified version of the same question

weston: That's good. At least as long questions requiring personal observations or reasoning aren't banned categorically.

Just since this seems of some interest, here's the suggested way(s), in total, as emailed:

Subject : your askme post was removed

Hi Peter,

We're trying hard to keep chatty questions off of AskMe which is why one of th eguidelines on the posting page says to think abotu the problem to be solved. If you have a question that isn't "I'd like to talk about this topic" please feel free ro repost and include that information [you can post again immediately]. Otherwise, questions like this are really better on MetaChat or on MonkeyFilter.

thanks. The text of your question is below.

Jessamyn

Also - yeah, that over-rated films thread is bullshit. I like it as a problem solving non-chatty topic, though.
posted by Peter H at 12:09 AM on November 5, 2005

This was a really good question and I was looking forward to reading it. Oh well. And, yeah, the over-rated films thread is very much along the same chatty lines as this one. Except a lot less interesting.
posted by TheDonF at 1:17 AM on November 5, 2005

If Peter H's interesting query is verboten, how come all those questions like My wife won't experiment in the bedroom [ten paragraphs of bibble about how wife has intimacy issues] - what can I do? or I'm sad and lonely [ten paragraphs of bibble about how anon. hasn't had a friend since the chess club at school]- what can I do? are allowed to stand? It's not like anyone can provide a definitive solution to those, they just chat provoke chat dressed up as caring advice. (Not that I mind those threads, really, it's just that they seem to be in the same mould.)
posted by jack_mo at 2:07 AM on November 5, 2005

'sfunny how the same people who complain the rules aren't clear want to bend them when they don't like the results.

just sayin.
posted by andrew cooke at 4:46 AM on November 5, 2005

Matt & Jessamyn have effectively said that they don't have a problem with the content of any of these questions, just the phrasing of the post and/or the intent of the poster. The term utility is often mentioned, but what is utility? Is there not a distinct utilitarian value to a repository of information that contains among its collection the personal anecdotes of many people on many subjects? The arguments presented in the fight to keep AskMe pure do not really address the intent of the administrators in this push.
posted by spaghetti at 7:44 AM on November 5, 2005

The question earlier about why holding an antenna increases reception didn't solve a problem either.

It's not the same thing. All cases of holding an antenna are the same, and it's a "how does this work?" kind of question. Changes in people's faces over time are individual, and the question was more of a "So, what about you?" kind of question. (And not in a "How did you solve this problem?" way)

I didn't have a problem with the thread at all, just trying to phrase what I think the distinctions are.
posted by easternblot at 10:44 AM on November 5, 2005

I also thought the thread shouldn't have been deleted. All MeFi deletions are in some sense arbitrary, but this one seems particularly arbitrary.
posted by languagehat at 1:12 PM on November 5, 2005

Maybe Matt or Jess have issues with their aging...
posted by five fresh fish at 1:29 PM on November 5, 2005

Why, for instance, was that thread any worse than this one ("does rock music from a decade ago seem undated for you?")?
posted by languagehat at 1:36 PM on November 5, 2005

Maybe Matt or Jess have issues with their aging...

Ha, a true possibility! Or maybe it's face intolerance. Maybe they're both a bunch of facists.
posted by Peter H at 2:01 PM on November 5, 2005

Well, my answer is:

I'm 37 and I have loads of wrinkles around my eyes. More interestingly, though, the two furrows that run from the side of my nose to the side of my mouth are much more pronouced than they were even 5 years ago, and this has changed the character of my face considerably. My face is slightly thinner for the same bodyweight - my cheekbones seem more obvious - than 10 years ago. I have terrible red vein damage on my cheeks which gets worse every year, and I have larger pale freckle-like pigmentation going on, especially round my eyes. I think there is more hair on my face too - certainly there are more dark ones than there used to be.

I don't imagine I will ever want surgery for wrinkles in general, but I am dreading jowliness. That's the thing that will finally make me feel old. Greying hair and laughter lines haven't.
posted by suleikacasilda at 2:17 PM on November 5, 2005

You're not planning on selling the answers

LOL, what?
posted by mr.marx at 2:30 PM on November 5, 2005

Thank you very much for your answer, suleikacasilda. I really liked it.

The most interesting change I'm starting to see in my face is signs of how I think or talk. Apparently I'm very asymmetric with the way I read and focus on things. Normally, my face is perfectly balanced but when I focus on things it's beginning to show the start of a good Geezer like pinched side, where one side sort of crumples up and the other side sort of enlarges to compensate for the lost realestate. There are wrinkles that are starting (lightly) to document this when my face isn't in focus mode. I enjoy it.

Also, to respond to FFF's comment about eyebrows - I have some antennas growing out too! My gf likes to tease me about them but she doesn't know they actually give me with the radar strength of a large cat. In a few years, anyway I hope.
posted by Peter H at 7:43 PM on November 5, 2005

Peter H, did you know that Mickey Mouse's face changed as he aged?
posted by grumblebee at 10:00 PM on November 5, 2005