Managing Music September 3, 2017 9:13 AM Subscribe
Can we have a 'Delete' button for posts on Music? More so than other subsites, it seems that we might want, and reasonably be allowed, to manage what works we keep available there.
If the proposed solution is "just email a mod", by the way, I don't like that solution. Even if it's minimal, it puts a social barrier in the way, and I'd rather be able to handle such things myself.
If the proposed solution is "just email a mod", by the way, I don't like that solution. Even if it's minimal, it puts a social barrier in the way, and I'd rather be able to handle such things myself.
I'm a musician, though I haven't posted much on MeMusic, and I think emailing is a reasonable solution, and is implicit in the structure of the site.
posted by Sebmojo at 3:04 PM on September 3, 2017
posted by Sebmojo at 3:04 PM on September 3, 2017
There'd be a problem with having a "delete" button on only some of the things you can delete. New users would infer that you can't delete things that don't have the delete button. You might think, "Well, that's silly, they can just email a mod" — but some of the newer users aren't going to realize that. Even if this has little effect, I'll bet it would deter more deletions than the extra step of emailing a mod to delete a music post.
posted by John Cohen at 3:39 PM on September 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by John Cohen at 3:39 PM on September 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
More so than other subsites, it seems that we might want, and reasonably be allowed, to manage what works we keep available there.
Maybe I'm out of the loop here, ok certainly so, but perhaps if you explained what it is that is substantially different to you about Music as compared to the other subsites. I certainly don't know but perhaps that's because I've only poked my head in once or twice.
posted by RolandOfEld at 5:13 PM on September 3, 2017
Maybe I'm out of the loop here, ok certainly so, but perhaps if you explained what it is that is substantially different to you about Music as compared to the other subsites. I certainly don't know but perhaps that's because I've only poked my head in once or twice.
posted by RolandOfEld at 5:13 PM on September 3, 2017
I think the main thing is the greater discrete effort involved in creating a post for Music—you're actually recording and mixing (and most of the time also writing/arranging) a song, and the thing you're posting is a sort of concrete chunk of creative work that may well have a life outside of MetaFilter. In that sense I totally understand the feeling of wanting to have more direct control over a song.
On the other hand, that's not really a wholly clearcut distinction; Projects posts are similar to Music in that way, just across a larger variety of media and formats. And posts and long-form comments both often represent significant creative writing and/or editing work. These are things that from a site administration perspective we both pointedly try to respect the copyright aspect of, but also don't provide push-button deletion options for; there, "contact a mod" is the standard approach, and allows us to mediate odd situations with some care while also generally shrugging and saying okay for most one-off "I wish this wasn't there anymore" requests.
Ultimately, the balance MeFi strikes on this is between auctorial control and community continuity; both are important and by having moderators act as a brake on e.g. impulsive content wipes we can handle a wide variety of situations with minimal if non-zero friction. It's not the approach everyone prefers, but it's one we've tried to be pretty clear about in documentation and metatalk discussion over the years as something that comes with posting stuff here.
posted by cortex (staff) at 7:07 PM on September 3, 2017
On the other hand, that's not really a wholly clearcut distinction; Projects posts are similar to Music in that way, just across a larger variety of media and formats. And posts and long-form comments both often represent significant creative writing and/or editing work. These are things that from a site administration perspective we both pointedly try to respect the copyright aspect of, but also don't provide push-button deletion options for; there, "contact a mod" is the standard approach, and allows us to mediate odd situations with some care while also generally shrugging and saying okay for most one-off "I wish this wasn't there anymore" requests.
Ultimately, the balance MeFi strikes on this is between auctorial control and community continuity; both are important and by having moderators act as a brake on e.g. impulsive content wipes we can handle a wide variety of situations with minimal if non-zero friction. It's not the approach everyone prefers, but it's one we've tried to be pretty clear about in documentation and metatalk discussion over the years as something that comes with posting stuff here.
posted by cortex (staff) at 7:07 PM on September 3, 2017
No. The purpose of MeFi music is that you are releasing your work to a cruel indifferent universe and if you are a snowflake that had second thoughts about the inanity of posting a silly experiment in Logic with the even sillier title "Loopy Loop" then you should not have posted it in the first place.
cortex--I want to talk to you about something bad I posted that I regret every day
posted by Slarty Bartfast at 11:54 PM on September 3, 2017 [13 favorites]
cortex--I want to talk to you about something bad I posted that I regret every day
posted by Slarty Bartfast at 11:54 PM on September 3, 2017 [13 favorites]
if you are a snowflake
You know nothing, John Snowflake.
Winter is come.
posted by the quidnunc kid at 1:49 AM on September 4, 2017 [2 favorites]
You know nothing, John Snowflake.
Winter is come.
posted by the quidnunc kid at 1:49 AM on September 4, 2017 [2 favorites]
(For the avoidance of doubt the above comment was just jiggling words in a mindless attempt to be silly, and not intended as insult, criticism or snark at S. Bartfast, J. Snow, S. Flake, C. Tex, M. Filter or any other person, and if I have rubbed anyone the wrong way I apologise sincerely for my thoughtlessness.)
posted by the quidnunc kid at 6:29 AM on September 4, 2017
posted by the quidnunc kid at 6:29 AM on September 4, 2017
> (For the avoidance of doubt the above comment was just jiggling words in a mindless attempt to be silly, and not intended as insult, criticism or snark at S. Bartfast, J. Snow, S. Flake, C. Tex, M. Filter or any other person, and if I have rubbed anyone the wrong way I apologise sincerely for my thoughtlessness.)
What has happened to the quidnunc kid?? I didn't vote for an apologetic #1!
posted by languagehat at 8:42 AM on September 4, 2017 [23 favorites]
What has happened to the quidnunc kid?? I didn't vote for an apologetic #1!
posted by languagehat at 8:42 AM on September 4, 2017 [23 favorites]
The problem as I find it, my Lord languagehat, is that rise of the forces of hatred in recent times has polluted not only the rivers of truth, but even the wide sea of nonsense.
It used to be the case that one could confidently (yet perhaps over-confidently) espouse all kinds of ridiculousness, safe in the expectation that one's interlocutors would assume that such nonsense was submitted nonsensically, and harmlessly, and not as some kind of twisted attack on others.
Or even claiming to believe (say) in the flatness of the Earth - once, one would just chuckle at the idea that a person would believe such a bizarre thing. But nowadays the armies of hate have embraced all kinds of pure mindlessness as their philosophy, and some say their captain is the font of all stupidity - and so I worry that even the tiniest pebble of nonsense might fall to be a weapon in his hands.
For that reason, my Lord, I am anxious for my every utterance, that it should not cause or connote in my comrades' hearts the same wounds that the cruel king of idiots would and does inflict with his every bleat. You are my Lord of language (also hats), and you will have heard of the foul tongue of these meagre fascists - who despise and mock the humble "snowflake" as some unworthy object.
Thus if I claim my Lord John Snowflake is king of the north, I should take care to ensure this nonsense is done truthfully, not hatefully; with hope and respect, and not with cruelty and malice. And I would beg others take my nonsense free of any hatred, or if they find hatred in my nonsense, that they return it to me - it is not meant for them.
posted by the quidnunc kid at 10:47 AM on September 4, 2017 [20 favorites]
It used to be the case that one could confidently (yet perhaps over-confidently) espouse all kinds of ridiculousness, safe in the expectation that one's interlocutors would assume that such nonsense was submitted nonsensically, and harmlessly, and not as some kind of twisted attack on others.
Or even claiming to believe (say) in the flatness of the Earth - once, one would just chuckle at the idea that a person would believe such a bizarre thing. But nowadays the armies of hate have embraced all kinds of pure mindlessness as their philosophy, and some say their captain is the font of all stupidity - and so I worry that even the tiniest pebble of nonsense might fall to be a weapon in his hands.
For that reason, my Lord, I am anxious for my every utterance, that it should not cause or connote in my comrades' hearts the same wounds that the cruel king of idiots would and does inflict with his every bleat. You are my Lord of language (also hats), and you will have heard of the foul tongue of these meagre fascists - who despise and mock the humble "snowflake" as some unworthy object.
Thus if I claim my Lord John Snowflake is king of the north, I should take care to ensure this nonsense is done truthfully, not hatefully; with hope and respect, and not with cruelty and malice. And I would beg others take my nonsense free of any hatred, or if they find hatred in my nonsense, that they return it to me - it is not meant for them.
posted by the quidnunc kid at 10:47 AM on September 4, 2017 [20 favorites]
I WILL VOTE FOR THIS THE QUIDNUNC KID PERSONAGE
WHO IS WITH ME
posted by cgc373 at 12:28 PM on September 4, 2017 [4 favorites]
WHO IS WITH ME
posted by cgc373 at 12:28 PM on September 4, 2017 [4 favorites]
(NOT A QUESTION, I'M SAYING THIS THE QUIDNUNC KID IS WITH ME)
(YOU DO YOU)
(WHAT DO I CARE)
posted by cgc373 at 12:29 PM on September 4, 2017 [6 favorites]
(YOU DO YOU)
(WHAT DO I CARE)
posted by cgc373 at 12:29 PM on September 4, 2017 [6 favorites]
What's weird is that my name actually is John Snowflake.
posted by Slarty Bartfast at 2:09 PM on September 4, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by Slarty Bartfast at 2:09 PM on September 4, 2017 [5 favorites]
Hail, King of the North!
posted by the quidnunc kid at 2:13 PM on September 4, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by the quidnunc kid at 2:13 PM on September 4, 2017 [3 favorites]
The first rule of King in the North media mashups is, DON'T PANIC.
posted by cgc373 at 2:19 PM on September 4, 2017
posted by cgc373 at 2:19 PM on September 4, 2017
Maybe a solution is to have a delete button that doesn't actually do anything. It could look all skeuomorphic, faux-1950's or flaming and Guy Fieri-ish, like all those shitty VST guitar pedal plug-ins.
posted by chococat at 3:17 PM on September 4, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by chococat at 3:17 PM on September 4, 2017 [5 favorites]
Man, I hate loud, idiosyncratic interfaces on VST plugins. Fruityloops (well, back when it was called Fruityloops) once had a nice stable of simple plugins that all had a standardized look'n'feel, and I wish all plugins were like that. I assume there's a customer base for all the weird decorative VST skins but I am not in it.
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 10:58 PM on September 4, 2017
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 10:58 PM on September 4, 2017
Can we have a direct Mefi plugin into Garageband so I can share the worst of my musical excess with y'all.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:44 AM on September 5, 2017
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:44 AM on September 5, 2017
The solution is to allow the user to press a "delete (cough)" button, and it will disappear from their logged-in view, but the music remains there for every one else. Then you could pique interest and drive traffic by highlighting the post: "The uploader tried to delete this song--check it out for yourself to find out why!".
This approach is extensible to all subsites, and reminds me of my parents.
posted by sylvanshine at 7:40 AM on September 5, 2017 [5 favorites]
This approach is extensible to all subsites, and reminds me of my parents.
posted by sylvanshine at 7:40 AM on September 5, 2017 [5 favorites]
...and some say their captain is the font of all stupidity...
I'd be offended, but -- it's a fair cop.
posted by Capt. Renault at 10:44 AM on September 5, 2017
I'd be offended, but -- it's a fair cop.
posted by Capt. Renault at 10:44 AM on September 5, 2017
Maybe a solution is to have a delete button that doesn't actually do anything.
Or maybe it does (¯`·._.··¸.-~*´¨¯¨`*·~-.,-(SOMETHING)-,.-~*´¨¯¨`*·~-.¸··._.·´¯)
posted by Rock Steady at 11:06 AM on September 6, 2017 [1 favorite]
Or maybe it does (¯`·._.··¸.-~*´¨¯¨`*·~-.,-(SOMETHING)-,.-~*´¨¯¨`*·~-.¸··._.·´¯)
posted by Rock Steady at 11:06 AM on September 6, 2017 [1 favorite]
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The existing solution is in fact that—hit the contact form and let us know what's up—and while I hear you on preferring a self-serve approach, that has been the policy we've run with for over a decade now and it's consistent with how we handle posts and comments everywhere else on the site as well. Adding a delete button to public-facing content on the site would be a pretty significant change to a long-standing site practice and culture.
That said, reaching out to the mods about it is totally fine; it's something that has come up now and then and it's a pretty painless thing. Just ping us to let us know something needs to come down and we'll take care of it promptly.
posted by cortex (staff) at 9:17 AM on September 3, 2017 [4 favorites]